
Arena Tournament Scheduling 

10132019, 09:13 PM

#1

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Glitchless is offline
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 8,507

Arena Tournament Scheduling
Any of the current top 16 teams (1 vote per team) may vote on what day they would prefer an elimination style tournament for the end of this season. The clock time is set at 6:00pm EST (17:00 Nodiatis Time), a Saturday, on either November 16th or 23rd.
To vote on which day you would prefer (16th or 23rd), DON'T POST IT HERE. If you have a hard scheduling conflict, you don't want your opponents to know. Email help@nodiatis.com with your vote. Include the full roster of your team and your current tops list position.
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Computing the probability that at least one of the following events will occur:
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10132019, 09:19 PM

#2

Seer's BFF
Tsutsu is offline
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 537

#1 we have multiple top 16 teams, we get multiple votes?
#2 how will the tournament be knockout best of 3 etc
#3 those are the only 2 dates correct?
#4 do we designate someone to vote for our team/s?
#5 we can go for any time period?
#6 how quickly will you let us know which day/time it is going to be?
#7 will it be 1 match at a time?
#8 are we going to be penalized for having so many top teams?



10132019, 09:20 PM

#3

Epic Scholar
RogueTigeR is offline
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: St. Louis
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Since this is a "postseason" tournament this time. Will we be able to spectate?..
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10132019, 09:31 PM

#4

Epic Scholar
flipynifty is offline
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Posts: 4,484

how would this work in tsus case as he cant face his team, that kind of kills some of the spread
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10142019, 12:08 AM

#5

Boss Hunter
Dennisthemenace is offline
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 198

This thread mentions an ending in November and on a saturday.
19th and 26th are not saturdays in November (they are saturdays in October). What are the correct choice dates?



10142019, 12:36 AM

#6

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Good catch. It will be the 16th or the 23rd.
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Computing the probability that at least one of the following events will occur:
P(a or b ... or z) = 1  P(!a and !b ... and !z)
Probability






10142019, 01:38 AM

#7

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Glitchless is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsutsu
#1 we have multiple top 16 teams, we get multiple votes?
#2 how will the tournament be knockout best of 3 etc
#3 those are the only 2 dates correct?
#4 do we designate someone to vote for our team/s?
#5 we can go for any time period?
#6 how quickly will you let us know which day/time it is going to be?
#7 will it be 1 match at a time?
#8 are we going to be penalized for having so many top teams?

#1 no
#2 see below
#3 yes
#4 yes
#5 no, read it again. The time is already set.
#6 we'd like people to have as much time to plan as possible, so we'll have a definitive answer by this Saturday
#7 see below
#8 no direct penalty, but if there needs to be multiple matches at once for time purposes, you may have trouble juggling and need to prioritize one over the other.
It would be a bad idea to have any kind of format based on points
One potential format being considered which avoids any RNG in team selection is:
Top 16 (at most) teams enter.
The 16th team has a best 2 of 3 vs the 15th team.
The winner of that has a best 2 of 3 vs the 14th team.
The winner of that has a best 2 of 3 vs the next team, etc
Until finally, a team advances all the way to face the current 1st place team for a best 3 of 5. 3 draws, or 1/1 win + draw would result in the higher ranked team advancing.
This would result in at most 14*3 + 5 = 47 matches, 10 mins per match, 470 mins or just under 8 hours. This is about 8 times longer than we'd want a tournament to be, which means we'd need to do some of the following:
i. Shorten max match length to 5 mins
ii. Have single elimination for teams 16 through 11
iii. Have multiple matches occur at once, ie 16 vs 15 faces the winner of 14 vs 13, winner of that faces winner of 12 vs 11, winner of that faces winner of 9 vs 8, etc, up until 5 vs 4. At that point, we could switch to 1 match at a time, so winner of 5 vs 4 goes against 3, winner of that goes against 2, winner of that goes against 1.
This format makes sense in general because it allows the 16th place team to potentially win, however, it makes it more difficult for them to do so by needing to beat many teams on their way. That way, there's still a reason to want to fight for the highest ranks prior to the tournament.
__________________
Computing the probability that at least one of the following events will occur:
P(a or b ... or z) = 1  P(!a and !b ... and !z)
Probability






10142019, 01:43 AM

#8

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Tsutsu is offline
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Posts: 537

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glitchless
#1 no
#2 see below
#3 yes
#4 yes
#5 no, read it again. The time is already set.
#6 we'd like people to have as much time to plan as possible, so we'll have a definitive answer by this Saturday
#7 see below
#8 no direct penalty, but if there needs to be multiple matches at once for time purposes, you may have trouble juggling and need to prioritize one over the other.
It would be a bad idea to have any kind of format based on points
One potential format being considered which avoids any RNG in team selection is:
Top 16 (at most) teams enter.
The 16th team has a best 2 of 3 vs the 15th team.
The winner of that has a best 2 of 3 vs the 14th team.
The winner of that has a best 2 of 3 vs the next team, etc
Until finally, a team advances all the way to face the current 1st place team for a best 3 of 5. 3 draws, or 1/1 win + draw would result in the higher ranked team advancing.
This would result in at most 14*3 + 5 = 47 matches, 10 mins per match, 470 mins or just under 8 hours. This is about 8 times longer than we'd want a tournament to be, which means we'd need to do some of the following:
i. Shorten max match length to 5 mins
ii. Have single elimination for teams 16 through 11
iii. Have multiple matches occur at once, ie 16 vs 15 faces the winner of 14 vs 13, winner of that faces winner of 12 vs 11, winner of that faces winner of 9 vs 8, etc, up until 5 vs 4. At that point, we could switch to 1 match at a time, so winner of 5 vs 4 goes against 3, winner of that goes against 2, winner of that goes against 1.
This format makes sense in general because it allows the 16th place team to potentially win, however, it makes it more difficult for them to do so by needing to beat many teams on their way. That way, there's still a reason to want to fight for the highest ranks prior to the tournament.

Well, I think the longest match we've had in this entire season wasn't even 5 minutes long. Which is most likely how the matches would go either way, considering the damage bonus in arena now.
Also, for clarity. Say we have a team in #1 and #3 and our #3 team beats the #2 team, will there be any penalty for us obviously throwing on one of our teams in the final?



10142019, 01:46 AM

#9

Administrator
Glitchless is offline
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Posts: 8,507

Specific feedback that is desired:
All other seasons have a 5 minute max arena fight length and faster damage gain to match (this was never true). Do players feel that there is a reason for the 3v3 premade season to remain at 10 mins, or is there a desire to have it work like the other seasons and remain at 5 mins max? If we needed a 5 min max for the final tourney, it would make sense to have fights during the season be 5 mins as well. It's not ideal to change something like that halfway, but it may be the lesser of two evils when compared to changing it only at the final tournament.
__________________
Computing the probability that at least one of the following events will occur:
P(a or b ... or z) = 1  P(!a and !b ... and !z)
Probability



10142019, 01:51 AM

#10

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Glitchless is offline
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 8,507

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsutsu
Also, for clarity. Say we have a team in #1 and #3 and our #3 team beats the #2 team, will there be any penalty for us obviously throwing on one of our teams in the final?

I'm not sure if you'd consider it a penalty, but in the case of two teams facing each other controlled by the same players, it might be better for us to just automatically advance the higher ranked of the two teams to prevent any shenanigans. This gets more complicated if there's only one person shared between the two teams, however, so maybe just let you duke it out regardless. If anyone has feedback on it, let it be known.
__________________
Computing the probability that at least one of the following events will occur:
P(a or b ... or z) = 1  P(!a and !b ... and !z)
Probability



10142019, 01:57 AM

#11

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Tsutsu is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glitchless
I'm not sure if you'd consider it a penalty, but in the case of two teams facing each other controlled by the same players, it might be better for us to just automatically advance the higher ranked of the two teams to prevent any shenanigans. This gets more complicated if there's only one person shared between the two teams, however, so maybe just let you duke it out regardless. If anyone has feedback on it, let it be known.

Was more refering to ban's for obvious throwing since that's against rules for arena.
Will the 10 tc reward for top 10 apply to the 16 teams then?



10142019, 02:02 AM

#12

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Rewards would be the same as always. The reason for this proposed format over a double elimination style format, is that the results of this format provides a clear reranking. Each team can lose at most 1 rank, yet the 16th team could theoretically move to 1st.
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Computing the probability that at least one of the following events will occur:
P(a or b ... or z) = 1  P(!a and !b ... and !z)
Probability



10142019, 02:48 AM

#13

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How much earlier in the day/week will the last arena match be played before the tournament and will there still be a rush week?



10142019, 03:10 AM

#14

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Last arena match could play right before tourney starts. Rush will be the week prior to tourney and be cut slightly short the last day by the start of the tourney.
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Computing the probability that at least one of the following events will occur:
P(a or b ... or z) = 1  P(!a and !b ... and !z)
Probability



10142019, 03:15 AM

#15

Rare Collector
Claudia is offline
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 852

Also if for what ever reasons a team doesn't compete in the tournament what happens? they automatically disqualified and someone else takes their place? Or... what?
Just wondering xD
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10142019, 07:31 AM

#16

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Glitchless is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Claudia
Also if for what ever reasons a team doesn't compete in the tournament what happens? they automatically disqualified and someone else takes their place? Or... what?
Just wondering xD

They won't be DQ'ed from the season. They'll lose their match by default and the team behind them will advance past their rank.
__________________
Computing the probability that at least one of the following events will occur:
P(a or b ... or z) = 1  P(!a and !b ... and !z)
Probability



10142019, 11:11 AM

#17

Boss Hunter
Khettry is offline
Join Date: Sep 2014
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Posts: 108

Khettry here, of (currently) #15 team of Khettry, Boog, and Bambam. It's a bad schedule since I NEVER play weekends. Do we get instaeliminated or can we schedule for something that will actually allow us to participate?
I cannot make an exception, so don't ask.
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Last edited by Khettry; 10142019 at 11:14 AM..



10142019, 11:18 AM

#18

Administrator
Glitchless is offline
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Posts: 8,507

If you can't make it, or you make it and lose every fight, you still only lose 1 rank max.
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Computing the probability that at least one of the following events will occur:
P(a or b ... or z) = 1  P(!a and !b ... and !z)
Probability



10142019, 11:21 AM

#19

Boss Hunter
Khettry is offline
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Posts: 108

What you say has merit, ofc, but we're able to consistently beat a couple of teams ahead of us (Claudia & Neela, with some inconsistent victories against DTM). If we happen to top them in rating, then we could be sent down several slots.
It's the first time I've been in a team that was worth more than just the bonus. All 3 of us have been on pilgrimage, including Boog's original pilg right after the update, and we've gone from my typical throwaway arrangement to an actual contender.
Fridays work 1000x better than Mondays, just in case.
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Last edited by Khettry; 10142019 at 11:46 AM..



10142019, 01:39 PM

#20

Seer's BFF
Roeth is offline
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 617

Quote:
Originally Posted by Khettry
What you say has merit, ofc, but we're able to consistently beat a couple of teams ahead of us (Claudia & Neela, with some inconsistent victories against DTM). If we happen to top them in rating, then we could be sent down several slots.

Glitch has already said, quite clearly, that you would lose, at most, one ranking place.



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